Onderwerp: [idea] Training not linked to order!

I think the restriction for training to prevent someone training 10 players on striker is ok, but the fact the training is linked to the order he plays with on the field is ridiculous.
My proposition is to make a training file with restricted places to train players, based on their amount of minutes played, regardless of order or position on the field.

F.e.:

GK: 2/10 +Add player
Pace: 10/10 +Add player
Technique: 10/10 +Add player
Passing: 10/10 +Add player
Defender: 10/10 +Add player
Playmaker: 10/10 +Add player
Striker: 6/10 +Add player

With each place taken, one place withdraws from the maximum total, so f.e....

GK: Victor Lampaert - 1/9 +Add player
Pace: 9/9 +Add player
Technique: 9/9 +Add player
Passing: 9/9 +Add player
Defender: 9/9 +Add player
Playmaker 9/9 +Add player
Striker: 6/9 +Add player

If all possible places are taken, the possibility of adding a player will disappear, f.e.

GK: Victor Lampaert - Erik Bisschop 0/8 max amount of players reached
Pace: 8/8 +Add player
Technique: 8/8 +Add player
Passing: 8/8 +Add player
Defender: 8/8 +Add player
Playmaker: 8/8 +Add player
Striker: 6/8 +Add player

If all training places are taken, this is an example of how the training file looks like then:

GK: Victor Lampaert - Erik Bisschop max amount of players reached 2/2
Pace: Adam Bielen - Zakaria Bostyn - Marc Correyn - Jannick Dupain max amount of players reached 4/4
Technique: Stephane Crabeels - Ronaldo Filardo - Roeland Simpelaere max amount of players reached 3/3
Passing: Arnaud Philipsen max amount of players reached 1/1
Defender: max amount of players reached 0/0
Playmaker: max amount of players reached 0/0
Striker: max amount of players reached 0/0

My opinion is that the restriction of having 10 training spots in total is more than enough restriction we need. To link it to order, while the order defines the playstyle of the player is just stupid.
The ME will always punish your player for playing wrong because of it. Just keep the minutes played, regardless of order or position (and injury) to determine the % of training the player gets.

Having the order linked to the training is like playing a shooter game with a shield as a weapon or a gun as a shield. It just doesn't make sence! While the owners wants us to play to the best of our abilities and to play for prices, they are restricting your growth so you have to choose to either sacrifice your training or your results. And because everyone knows training is superior VS playing for results in comparison to team growth, the majority of managers will neglect the one thing the owners wants us to do, and that is playing for results. And as a result, people are losing interest in the game.

With my proposition, you will have far more teams being able to play for results and combine it with decent training, which will result in better players, stronger teams on average and thus stronger competitions with much more tactical importance to fight for your place!

In real life, all players of a team train, regardless of playing minutes. In Sokker, the restriction of having only 10 players available for training + linking it to the minutes played, regardless of order or position is imo more than enough restriction we need to have a balanced managing game, which on it's turn will have to do much more with football, than it does right now.

I'm even willing to add other restrictions to the training if necessary:

F.e,
- max 5 players for 1 training like pace or defender f.e....
- Max 4 different kinds of training, like it is now, also ok for me.

I bet that if we do a poll to ask managers to disconnect training from order, more than 90% will vote in favor of the idea!
There will always be people who will think it's a bad idea which will benefit the ''farmers'', but I recon that the game will benefit from it on the long term.
As for the new managers, well...with this change, they will be able to play for results much faster, without having to chose to either play for results or to train to grow their team.
Because as it is now, new teams need to build their team and discart their chances for playing for results because of it. So basically, the game, as it is now, forces new teams to farm for years on, before even having a chance to compete against the older teams. And how does that motivate new managers to continue playing? Giving new teams better starting options is off course imperative to faster growth, like better starting players, better coaches and a larger starting stadium.

Anyways, My suggestion is open for adjustments and ideas, but long story short, the training needs to be disconnected from the orders! It's by far the worst part of the game, along with form, but that's another topic!

+1

I disagree. Training is so easy already. No need to tackle this with any priority, imo.

I would like to stop at the first point.
Why can't a team insert 4 strikers?
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Agree on some points like the order of the player in the match but not sure if making this easier is the way. This training system is already mote flexible than the previous one.

I want to add something, altough not related to advanced training.
Is that for players that dont receive advance training, we shouldnt select what position to train. I say this because I have seen couple of players (NT) which after they have been bought, the assigned position on training is wrong. The manager never realizes, so altought that guy play every match, it is like he never played again. Drops form, experience and skill drops are much faster

I disagree. Training is so easy already. No need to tackle this with any priority, imo.

Sure...but is it also while playing for your country's main title?
That's the exact point...
Why do we need to choose to either train young players OR play for the highest possible spot in your country?

@Behmen: I would like to stop at the first point.
Why can't a team insert 4 strikers?

Because it is linked to your training! Because you would lose training...
But if the order doesn't matter for training, then a manager can choose to place 4, 5 or even 10 strikers...
Why should it matter how many ATT orders you place on the pitch? Isn't it the manager's decision? Isn't that what managing is all about?

@nerozurro: You cannot expect the NT / U21 coach to consider playing him with the order he gets training on at his club. With my proposition, this is no longer an issue and the player will receive training regardless, IF it's an official NT match, obviously.

But this is not about making the game easier... No on the contrary. Shouldn't the game not be harder if your average opponent is much stronger than they are now?
How many teams neglect their sportive aspect in the game, due to the fact they don't want to sacrifice their training?

simply because a crucial part of managing is making decisions...

The less decisions you'll have to take the more boring the game becomes.

Doesn't matter if play in lower league or fight for titles...
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And by the way, with the tactics editor you have still a lot of flexibility to even play with 5 striker. They just won't have all att oders and behave a bit different.

What I'd support are flexible orders which can be attributed to specific players and affect the style they play. But much more specific than just def, mid or att assignment.
I guess we have already dreamed for such change with significant impact on ME many many years. I don't think it will ever come.

My proposition doesn't involve ME changes.
It's only making the necessity of placing an order for the match and not for the training anymore.
Besides, you can play with 10 ATT order, even now...
It just will prevent training.

The less decisions you'll have to take the more boring the game becomes.

You still have to play the trainees! But with this, you can play them with a correct order! You're not bind to set players on the pitch with a wrong order, because they need that order to receive training. Imo matches are matches and training is training.
A game is supposed to be fun and challenging, not unrealistic when simulating realism...

Anyways, that is your opinion, thi is mine. I don't like the order restrictions for training. It's not about challenging or being boring. It's about making sense...