Onderwerp: Is profesional football sick or healty

Hi all,

I like to have a discussion over the financial positions of the profesional football clubs in europe. Here in Holland we are talking about it because here a lot of clubs are in problems. We have allready 1 club who did broke and went out of competition. It looks like there can be 2 or 3 other clubs who can go broke also and get out of competition also.
We also know that there are a lot of big international clubs who have big loans standing out and spent a lot of money on players and salary. Is this honest to clubs who have no loans at all? And can keep those clubs this up or shall they go bankrupt also?

Please keep the discussion without bad words about clubs. So you don't insult other persons.
If this is a problem please mods close this topic.

Like I wrote in the dutch topic, I think football is very sick!
Champions League and Europa League are 1 big fraud, clubs are spending money they don't have, and another big problem, different rules in different countries (specially loans and licences). Every country should have the same rules, then there is 1 real fair winner.

(gewijzigd)

Interesting topic. The whole financial system could exist because of credit (loans). This is also true for football clubs. Clubs receive loans from third parties. Problems starting to arise when clubs cannot repay their debt, not the fact that clubs receive loans. I often think that people say clubs are not healthy, because they have a lot of debt. But it is not problematic as long as clubs can repay these debts.

yearsalary 50 best payed players in the world
1. Cristiano Ronaldo (Real Madrid, 12,9 miljoen euro)
2. Zlatan Ibrahimovic (Barcelona, 12 miljoen euro)
3. Lionel Messi (Barcelona, 10,4 miljoen euro)
4. Samuel Eto'o (Internazionale, 10,4 miljoen euro)
5. Kaka (Real Madrid, 10 miljoen euro)
6. Emmanuel Adebayor (Manchester City, 8,5 miljoen euro)
7. Karim Benzema (Real Madrid, 8,5 miljoen euro)
8. Carlos Tevez (Manchester City, 8 miljoen euro)
9. John Terry (Chelsea, 7,4 miljoen euro)
10. Frank Lampard (Chelsea, 7,4 miljoen euro)

11. Thierry Henry (Barcelona, 7,4 miljoen euro)
12. Xavi (Barcelona, 7,4 miljoen euro)
13. Ronaldinho (AC Milan, 7,4 miljoen euro)
14. Steven Gerrard (Liverpool, 7,4 miljoen euro)
15. Daniel Alves (Barcelona, 7 miljoen euro)
16. Michael Ballack (Chelsea, 6,4 miljoen euro)
17. Raul (Real Madrid, 6,4 miljoen euro)
18. Rio Ferdinand (Manchester United, 6,4 miljoen euro)
19. Kolo Toure (Manchester City, 6,4 miljoen euro)
20. Wayne Rooney (Manchester United, 6 miljoen euro)

21. Robinho (Manchester City, 6 miljoen euro)
22. Iker Casillas (Real Madrid, 6 miljoen euro)
23. Victor Valdez (Barcelona, 6 miljoen euro)
24. Frederic Kanoute (Sevilla, 6 miljoen euro)
25. Deco (Chelsea, 6 miljoen euro)
26. Didier Drogba (Chelsea, 5,5 miljoen euro)
27. Gianluigi Buffon (Juventus, 5,5 miljoen euro)
28. Francesco Totti (Roma, 5,5 miljoen euro)
29. Luca Toni (Roma, 5,5 miljoen euro)
30. David Villa (Valencia, 5,5 miljoen euro)

31. Arjen Robben (Bayern Munich, 5,5 miljoen euro)
32. Bastian Schweinsteiger (Bayern Munich, 5,5 miljoen euro)
33. Ashley Cole (Chelsea, 5,5 miljoen euro)
34. Fernando Torres (Liverpool, 5,5 miljoen euro)
35. Gareth Barry (Manchester City, 5,5 miljoen euro)
36. Patrick Vieira (Internazionale, 5,5 miljoen euro)
37. Charles Puyol (Barcelona, 5 miljoen euro)
38. Andres Iniesta (Barcelona, 5 miljoen euron)
39. Sergio Aguero (Atletico Madrid, 5 miljoen euro)
40. Andreas Pirlo (AC Milan, 5 miljoen euro)

41. Willy Sagnol (Bayern Munich, 5 miljoen euro)
42. Franck Ribery (Bayern Munich, 5 miljoen euro)
43. David Beckham (AC Milan, 5 miljoen euro)
44. Wayne Bridge (Manchester City, 5 miljoen euro)
45. Lassana Diarra (Real Madrid, 5 miljoen euro)
46. Dimitar Berbatov (Manchester United, 4,7 miljoen euro)
47. Andrei Arshavin (Arsenal, 4,7 miljoen euro)
48. Nicolas Anelka (Chelsea, 4,7 miljoen euro)
49. Ryan Giggs (Manchester United, 4,7 miljoen euro)
50. Alessandro Del Piero (Juventus, 4,7 miljoen euro)


if you compare that with usain bolt one of the greatest athletes EVER
he made 5 million dollar in 2009
players are payed TO much i think

(gewijzigd)

This is without sponsor deals and stuff? Because I guess this is unfair comparison to Bolt, because Bolt has to get his payments from sponsor deals and prize money. Football players are employees of a club.

Yes you are right about that. Only we do see here in Holland that clubs can't repay their debt. We see also that some big clubs can get out of debt by "strange" constructions.

Real had to sell their trainingground and after that they have big loans again.
Chelsea did get out of loans by making new stocks. Still have 50 million euro to short every year.
Others have to find a really rich person also to get rid of loans.

true, portsmouth fc could be gone soon..

Strange constructions are part of the world. People are looking for loopholes in lawbooks and try to profit from what is allowed.

which clubs from holland are near bankrupt?
just to know to bet against them :))

Bv Veendam
RKC

Are in the biggest problems right now.

Haarlem is for a few weeks declared bankrupt and is out of competition.

@ Toontje did change it.
(gewijzigd)

BV Veendam:P

@ anaconda
No clubs to be scared of:P You should bet against them anyway:P

BV Veendam is in the 'Eerste Divisie' and RKC Waalwijk is the team standing last in the 'Eredivisie'.
(gewijzigd)

bigger clubs can always be bailed out by rich fans. But yea, there is no real problem until loans can not be payed back and then the bigger clubs have many ways and tricks to save them. Their name alone is worth a lot of money, for example.
And nothing will be lost when a smaller club goes bankrupt, of course. The system can survive those bankruptcies, I mean. So, I don't think the problem is worse than somewhere else (living and expaning large until the bubble bursts and then investing somewhere else is the normal thing these days, I heard).

For the fans, especially of smaller teams, yes, it's not very fun. Richer teams destroy the competition while they run bigger risks of blowing themselves up.

is sick, even i enjoy playing and watching football games, too many amount of money inside...plus the real problem, wich is some tmes mayor´s loans to clubs or some "strange" loans, no transparency always

Man United are in £700 million of debt.
Portsmouth FC are nearing bankruptcy.
Rangers are in £30 million of debt.
Cardiff City are in millions of debt.
Gretna FC don't exist anymore due to financial problems.

It's a shame to see clubs disappearing but it's their fault in the first place

Gretna is a rare case though, with their sugardaddy who got ill. Same thing as Man City at the moment, if their Arab sheikh quits.

and Hoffenheim ;)